DRM, downloadable content, load times etc..

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Re: DRM, downloadable content, load times etc..

Postby wodahSShadow » Mon, 15Mar23 01:20

sportd wrote: On completion of theGym, I fired up my laptop which was a clean Windows install with all the updates(reduced the speed dramatically) and the game ground to a halt trying to play. The bottleneck was the js. I released early downloads (unfinsihed) for people here to play and some of the feedback was the same. laggy because of the js.


That feed back must be hidden because none of the posts I saw on The Gym's thread complain about performance problems. Unfortunately I didn't keep the older versions so I can't check what could possibly be making a game of this kind run slow.

You're right that javascript isn't at fault here. You keep hammering on this idea that performance is a problem, it isn't. You even proved it by making The Gym work without any crazy optimization.

sportd wrote:The speed difference may be small but it seemed to be good practice and it made game development a lot quicker.


No surprise there, you really like using arrays in javascript.

Greyelf wrote:No explanation explaining to us why it is wrong?
It follows the principles you state you believe in!


You said your assertion that artists would have difficulty making a living without copyright laws is likely wrong. I can't explain your lack of confidence in your assertions. I've said already why the future isn't so grim as you make it seem.

Greyelf wrote:What they are actually doing is controlling some of the data stored on the HDD through copyrights, not the physical object it self which you have do with as you like.


You say "what they are actually doing" as if I'm not aware that's what they're actually doing. I'm aware.

They can't control that data without seizing the HDD or forcing me to change it. Either way my ownership of it is undermined because there's a pattern on it that matches the pattern someone magically "owns".

Greyelf wrote:Contract laws and the ability to sue someone are built upon the ownership/rights conveyed by Copyright.


No they're not. You write into the contract promises and terms that make it work as copyright between you and whoever signs. That's the difference, according to the concept of intellectual property your ownership can magically expand over anyone's actual property without permission.

Greyelf wrote:Unless your idea is directly derived (a copy) from theirs at which point what you do with you idea can affect the use of theirs.


You'll have to tell me how that's possible. An example please.
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Re: DRM, downloadable content, load times etc..

Postby Greyelf » Mon, 15Mar23 04:45

wodahSShadow wrote:You say "what they are actually doing" as if I'm not aware that's what they're actually doing. I'm aware.

They can't control that data ...

I have no way to know what you're aware of or not, but your original statement "My HDD is mine but through copyrights you can undermine my ownership of it." implied that by restricting what you can do with some of the data stored on your HDD that they were somehow able to undermine your ownership of the physical object itself, and I was just pointing out that that is incorrect.

They can control that data by enforcing the terms you legally agreed to when/if you downloaded your copy of their data from a source controlled by them.

wodahSShadow wrote:You write into the contract promises and terms...

And what makes those promises and terms legally binding?
And what is one of the sources those Laws use to define ownership and the rights of an owner of an original work?

wodahSShadow wrote:You'll have to tell me how that's possible. An example please.

a. Two people corroborating on an idea in location considered as private are overheard by a third party which is able to convert the idea to product before the original two people. It is not unreasonable to think that the original two may need to change their idea to compensate for the situation.

b. A Composer has the sheet music to a new tune they are working on sitting on their desk, this tune is meant to be an unique wedding present for friends. While the composer is out of room their housekeeper takes a photo of the sheet music, posts it on the internet where someone records it. It is not unreasonable to believe that the Composer will have to change the music so that it is unique again.
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Re: DRM, downloadable content, load times etc..

Postby wodahSShadow » Mon, 15Mar23 13:20

You say "restricting what you can do with some of the data stored on your HDD", that's undermining the ownership. There are now patterns of data I can write on my HDD that would be yours to control, you'd control the media because that's where the pattern is, that's partial ownership. Are you going to say again that my ownership is unchanged?

Greyelf wrote:They can control that data by enforcing the terms you legally agreed to when/if you downloaded your copy of their data from a source controlled by them.


There's a difference between making a contract and then breaching that contract by making a copy and automatically breaking a law by acquiring a copy. The first is the contract I spoke of, the second is copyright.

Greyelf wrote:And what makes those promises and terms legally binding?


Depends on the country, in the USA there's common law, a judge would decide, in accordance with previous judge rulings if the situation is similar, which parts, or all of the contract, are legally binding and how much compensation is fair. Since copyright laws have already been agreed on and developed I doubt that abolishing copyright as it exists now would make it impossible for you to write a contract with similar terms and conditions that isn't accepted by a judge.

Greyelf wrote:a. Two people corroborating on an idea in location considered as private are overheard by a third party which is able to convert the idea to product before the original two people. It is not unreasonable to think that the original two may need to change their idea to compensate for the situation.


Need to? No, the use of the idea by the third party wouldn't affect the ability for the first party to create the product as well. You could say that there are scarce resources that the third party might acquire in a way to make it impossible for the first party to produce anything but you surely realize it is unrelated to copyrights or intellectual property. This is an important point, your example involves transformation of scarce/rivalrous material into something else and there lies the conflict, not in the idea.

There's also the question of invasion of privacy that is left ambiguous in your example. That's another venue through which the first party might ask for compensation.

Greyelf wrote:b. A Composer has the sheet music to a new tune they are working on sitting on their desk, this tune is meant to be an unique wedding present for friends. While the composer is out of room their housekeeper takes a photo of the sheet music, posts it on the internet where someone records it. It is not unreasonable to believe that the Composer will have to change the music so that it is unique again.


That affects how the composer wants the music to be perceived, not his use of it. He still has total freedom to do as he wishes with the music, he doesn't, however, have the right to make others find it unique. Privacy also seems to be a problem in this example but since the housekeeper is hired and allowed to enter the house I'm not sure how exactly it is a problem.

Why do both of your examples have this invasion of privacy side to them?
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Re: DRM, downloadable content, load times etc..

Postby luke » Mon, 15Mar23 13:53

This thread looks like a legal expert fight, where each one has a different reading of laws. And for a non English speaker, as I am, it's near to reading chinese...

But it's far, far away from the technical problem sportd had.
So, please, enough off-topic.

Otherwise, mods will use their prerogatives.
Thank you.
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Re: DRM, downloadable content, load times etc..

Postby zuleyka » Sun, 15Aug02 10:54

DRM did not work.

Any gaming software for screen capture like Fraps or Playclaw allows torrent pirates to rip your content.
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