DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby Eldormain » Wed, 17Jul26 02:15

I think he might be referring to just the size of the image. The difference with the Pixel Size option in DAZ3D, if I am not mistaken, is the larger the image (Pixel Size) the better quality.

And, Mortze, you are totally correct about render times. The 1250 by 625 takes so much less time then the programs default of 1400+ by something (and not a 1 to 2 ratio). Sadly, I messed up and didn't save a couple of my images after rendering. Meaning, I posed an image and rendered it then used the same image to pose the next image without saving the one I had just done, only the rendered image. So, I am either going to have to go back and recreate the image from one either before or after or just try to deal with it when getting it into whatever tool I use. But the render time for the smaller Pixel Size is so much nicer.

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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby MaxCarna » Wed, 17Jul26 07:18

My value right now is 1649x745 Pixel Size and Aspect Ratio 1649x745, is based on the Active Viewport by default.

Your discussion called my attention that this value change when I resize the side panels, that can cause distinct renderings from the same .duf file.

I wil start to pay attention on that, maybe adopting 1250x625 for all renders.

I didn't understand the "a 1 to 2 ratio". Something like images with 1250x625 aspect ratio and 625x312.5 pixels (less quality)? Or 2500x1250 pixels (more quality)?
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby kexter » Wed, 17Jul26 09:22

MaxCarna wrote:maybe adopting 1250x625 for all renders.
If you plan on distributing images as JPEGs, keep in mind that JPEG is a 8×8 block based format so if your width and height are not divisible by 8 then you are leaving compression performance on the table. You could go with either 1248×624 or 1280×640; both of which keep the 2:1 ratio. If you have the rendering power then you can try and aim for 1920×960.

MaxCarna wrote:I didn't understand the "a 1 to 2 ratio". Something like images with 1250x625 aspect ratio and 625x312.5 pixels (less quality)? Or 2500x1250 pixels (more quality)?
The aspect ratio of an image describes the proportional relationship between its width and its height. It is commonly expressed as two numbers separated by a colon, as in 16:9.
(source: Wikipedia)
Basically: find the greatest common divisor (Wikipedia) for the width and height, divide both the width and the height by the divisor you found, and put a colon between them.
Taking 1024×768 as an example:
width = 1024 = 2*2*2*2*2*2*2*2*2*2 = 2^10 or (2^8)*(2*2) or (2^8)*4
height = 768 = 2*2*2*2*2*2*2*2*3 = (2^8)*3
greatest common divisor (gcd) = 2^8 = 256
width/gcd = 1024/256 = 4
height/gcd = 768/256 = 3
So the aspect ratio is 4:3
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby Eldormain » Wed, 17Jul26 10:29

With that excellently stated, MaxCarna, the Pixel Size would be the 1250x625 which we have been referring to as the resolution. I won't be able to do a better job of explaining aspect ratio. However, what Mortze and Tlaero were mentioning was that their images were twice as long as they are tall. When you do the math this ensure the image will scale the same as you resize it in various programs. There are things built in to some programs that will keep an image from stretching or smooshing. However, not all do. Which is what Tlaero had asked me about in her post that I missed, apologies Tlaero (and I wasn't referring to any program other then DAZ3D. I had spent too much time overlooking the Pixel Size and Aspect Ratio. I went back and tested it at the 2:1 ratio and 1250x625 deciding the render times were much more manageable).

My DAZ3D defaulted to an aspect ratio of 41:25. I switched the drop-down at the top under Render Settings to Custom and then changed the aspect ratio to 50:25 (2:1) and this altered the Pixel Size above to match. Then I just changed the Pixel Size to 1250x625 (needing only to change one of them and the other falls in line).

As I understand it, when you increase the Pixel Size you will increase the quality of the image as well as the render times. This is due to more detail filling in the larger pixel size.

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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby Mortze » Wed, 17Jul26 13:59

Putting it simple, the rendering process ends with the graphic card processor defining what RGB (Red-Green-Blue) colour value goes for each pixel in the picture. It does that with complex calculations. The more pixels in a picture, the more calculations the GPU has to make. More time to render.
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby MaxCarna » Wed, 17Jul26 16:35

kexter wrote:If you plan on distributing images as JPEGs, keep in mind that JPEG is a 8×8 block based format so if your width and height are not divisible by 8 then you are leaving compression performance on the table. You could go with either 1248×624 or 1280×640; both of which keep the 2:1 ratio. If you have the rendering power then you can try and aim for 1920×960.


Thank you very much for this class. Basically I can set 1280x640 in pixel size and 2:1 ratio, very simple.

Eldormain wrote:There are things built in to some programs that will keep an image from stretching or smooshing


In Afteernoon to Remember we are using Boostrap but in the game I intend to launch I will use W3.css responsive, setting the maxheight property to avoid the image to overflow ultrawide screens like mine. Not sure if I will also use the 3 image sizes, because of the size of the folder, don't know if the "Look and feel" pays the extra size.
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby tlaero » Thu, 17Jul27 04:56

Mortze wrote:Putting it simple, the rendering process ends with the graphic card processor defining what RGB (Red-Green-Blue) colour value goes for each pixel in the picture. It does that with complex calculations. The more pixels in a picture, the more calculations the GPU has to make. More time to render.


It's a little bit more complicated than this. If you render the exact same scene in two resolutions, the one with more pixels will take longer. But a lot of things have a bigger impact on the render time than the number of pixels. Scene complexity is much bigger. Render a scene with one model in front of a white background, and it'll go faster than a scene with that model in a 3d rendered bookstore with racks of books behind her. That'll be true even if you render the simple image at a higher resolution than the complex one. Similarly, lights can have a big impact on render time.

Note that a flat jpg background doesn't really add to the render time. So if you want to render something with a really complex background, sometimes it's better to do it in multiple steps. For instance, say you want to render an image of a lady dancing at a nightclub with 10 other people behind her. You could put all 11 people into the scene, tell it to render, and then come back in a few hours. Or you could render the scene with just one or two of the background people and save it as a PNG. Then remove those two people from the scene, make the PNG be the background, and add two more people to the scene and render it. Now use THAT PNG as the background, remove the two, add a few more, etc. In this way you can build up the complexity of the scene with more quicker renders. It won't be perfect, because the shadows from one couple won't interact with the later people, but for some situations, it might save you a lot of time. Also, if you do a couple backgrounds this way, you might be able to get away with using them for a larger number of foreground images. Imagine 3 backgrounds without the main character in it with people dancing in different poses. Then make 10 images with the main character that cycle through those 3 backgrounds. It's not as good as fully posing everything every time, but it's not bad either. Most of the Keeley-verse games used stock images that weren't even rendered. Things are way better with Mortze's fully rendered scenes, but the Keeley-verse games were acceptable.

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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby MaxCarna » Thu, 17Jul27 05:26

Just reinforcing that, there is some games out there where the background is a photo and only the character is rendered. Some users don't minded it. There are several levels to test to achieve the best cost effective.

Some nice tips here http://dhruv3d.deviantart.com/journal/B ... -615736235

Apply !Iray Uber Base on a non-Iray surface, usually don't change its visual.

For overall time, what really helped me, was the batch render tool. I make 10 to 15 scenes at night and let them render at dawn.
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby GDS » Fri, 17Jul28 23:05

MaxCarna wrote:Just reinforcing that, there is some games out there where the background is a photo and only the character is rendered. Some users don't minded it. There are several levels to test to achieve the best cost effective.

Some nice tips here http://dhruv3d.deviantart.com/journal/B ... -615736235

Apply !Iray Uber Base on a non-Iray surface, usually don't change its visual.

For overall time, what really helped me, was the batch render tool. I make 10 to 15 scenes at night and let them render at dawn.


Hint 2. Smaller Texture size,

wont that look ugly?
[*]Suddenly a Party!:http://the-new-lagoon.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3965
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby Mortze » Fri, 17Jul28 23:15

GDS wrote:Hint 2. Smaller Texture size,

wont that look ugly?


That's for when the object is far from the camera, too small or unfocused. When the eye can't catch the little details there's no need to have those details in the first place.
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby GDS » Fri, 17Jul28 23:23

Mortze wrote:
GDS wrote:Hint 2. Smaller Texture size,

wont that look ugly?


That's for when the object is far from the camera, too small or unfocused. When the eye can't catch the little details there's no need to have those details in the first place.

Never managed to use the camera focus, they always end up ugly, Does anyone have some tips on that?
[*]Suddenly a Party!:http://the-new-lagoon.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3965
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby Eldormain » Sun, 17Jul30 11:01

Probably the easiest to work with is the Depth of Field (DoF). Once you place a camera you can click on the Camera option and you will be able to turn the DoF on or off. It will be off by default. Then there are a couple sliders, F-Stop and one other like F-Stop distance or something. These allow you to move a couple squares/rectangles that appear when you turn on DoF. Anything between the two shapes will be clear. Anything outside of will be blurry.

You can also blur stuff in post work with PS or Gimp (others too I assume). But for blurred backgrounds it's easier and less time consuming to do it in DAZ3D. Plus, as it has been mentioned, it will reduce render times.

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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby lydia02 » Sun, 17Aug20 04:20

Total daz newbie. Trying to create various renders that I will be using for my new game. Aspiring to the images that vendors post for the models that they create. For example the model below:

Image

Are photos such as these the result of high quality daz rendors and photoshop? I do not own or have used photoshop but do have gimp if that would help improve the rendors. Below is my effort for the same model.

Image

Would appreciate constructive comments that would help improve my rendor results. Thanks.
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby MaxCarna » Sun, 17Aug20 06:05

Hi Lydia02,

I would guess the main question is the source of light.

In your scene we see a direct strong source, maybe is your camera headlamp. I, at least, always select the camera and in the camera tab, turn the headlamp to off, default is auto. In the target model you can see that the main light on the face is coming from the left.

On the Daz Studio User Guide, section 7.6 is talk about the 3 Point Rig, you can google it also. It uses 3 light sources: key light, fill light and rim light. Is a nice set to begin. You can play with the temperature config on the light's panel, from cold to warm to see the results.

About the model, you can add makeup and change the color on the Materials on Smart content. Some vendors sell the HD add on to his model

She is not touching the ground.

I can't say if they don't use photoshop but you can come closer using Daz only.
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Re: DAZ3D - Beginner Questions

Postby tlaero » Sun, 17Aug20 19:25

Hey Lydia,

I suggest a few things:
1) Start by rendering just the model (leave the background plain). This will dramatically speed up your render time and let you experiment more quickly. The reflective walls of the shower slowed down the render quite a bit. Experiment with just the character, get comfortable with her, and then add in backgrounds and other things.

2) Focus your initial efforts on the face. Humans (even men) are hardwired for faces and will notice them before bodies. Men might spend more time looking at breasts and hips, etc, but they will see the face first. In the face, the biggest difference between your render and the professional one is that in the pro one, she's looking directly at the camera, as though she's interested in you, the person looking at her. In yours she's looking up and to camera left, not "making eye contact" as it were. The result is that the pro one seems more sexually enticing, even though yours is the same model, in a towel, and almost showing some nipple.

3) There are two rendering technologies. "3Dlight" and "iRay." Which are you using for your render? I suspect you're on 3Dlight and the pro one is on iRay. IRay renders require a better 3d card in your computer and take longer to render (some of Mortze's renders in Finding Miranda took 4 hours!) but can have better results.

I hope you keep at it.

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